Buddhist Understanding of Emptiness.

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WesleyP
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Buddhist Understanding of Emptiness.

Post by WesleyP » Thu Jun 06, 2019 4:30 am

What is the Buddhist reading on Emptiness? . .

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Grigoris
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Re: Buddhist Understanding of Emptiness.

Post by Grigoris » Thu Jun 06, 2019 7:22 am

WesleyP wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 4:30 am
What is the Buddhist reading on Emptiness? . .
All phenomena arise based (dependent) on causes and conditions, they do not exist exist due to some inherent essence or quality. They are empty of an inherent essence or quality.
"My religion is not deceiving myself."
Jetsun Milarepa 1052-1135 CE

"Butchers, prostitutes, those guilty of the five most heinous crimes, outcasts, the underprivileged: all are utterly the substance of existence and nothing other than total bliss."
The Supreme Source - The Kunjed Gyalpo
The Fundamental Tantra of Dzogchen Semde

WesleyP
Posts: 81
Joined: Thu May 30, 2019 10:20 am

Re: Buddhist Understanding of Emptiness.

Post by WesleyP » Thu Jun 06, 2019 7:37 am

Grigoris wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 7:22 am
WesleyP wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 4:30 am
What is the Buddhist reading on Emptiness? . .
All phenomena arise based (dependent) on causes and conditions, they do not exist exist due to some inherent essence or quality. They are empty of an inherent essence or quality.


Is this somehow related to the doctrine of Impermanence? . .

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Grigoris
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Re: Buddhist Understanding of Emptiness.

Post by Grigoris » Thu Jun 06, 2019 7:46 am

WesleyP wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 7:37 am
Grigoris wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 7:22 am
WesleyP wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 4:30 am
What is the Buddhist reading on Emptiness? . .
All phenomena arise based (dependent) on causes and conditions, they do not exist exist due to some inherent essence or quality. They are empty of an inherent essence or quality.


Is this somehow related to the doctrine of Impermanence? . .
Yes, because all things that arise based on causes and conditions will deteriorate and cease existing at some point since the causes and conditions generally are impermanent and arise dependent on previous causes and conditions, ad nauseum.
"My religion is not deceiving myself."
Jetsun Milarepa 1052-1135 CE

"Butchers, prostitutes, those guilty of the five most heinous crimes, outcasts, the underprivileged: all are utterly the substance of existence and nothing other than total bliss."
The Supreme Source - The Kunjed Gyalpo
The Fundamental Tantra of Dzogchen Semde

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Aemilius
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Re: Buddhist Understanding of Emptiness.

Post by Aemilius » Thu Jun 06, 2019 8:14 am

How is it that emptiness sounds just boring? The word is so worn out, it is empty of freshness, empty of meaning.
svaha
"All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights.
They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.
Sarvē mānavāḥ svatantrāḥ samutpannāḥ vartantē api ca, gauravadr̥śā adhikāradr̥śā ca samānāḥ ēva vartantē. Ētē sarvē cētanā-tarka-śaktibhyāṁ susampannāḥ santi. Api ca, sarvē’pi bandhutva-bhāvanayā parasparaṁ vyavaharantu."
Universal Declaration of Human Rights, Article 1. (in english and sanskrit)

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Grigoris
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Location: Greece

Re: Buddhist Understanding of Emptiness.

Post by Grigoris » Thu Jun 06, 2019 8:20 am

Aemilius wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 8:14 am
How is it that emptiness sounds just boring? The word is so worn out, it is empty of freshness, empty of meaning.
Because it is "boring". Empty is just the way things are. There is nothing exciting about that.
"My religion is not deceiving myself."
Jetsun Milarepa 1052-1135 CE

"Butchers, prostitutes, those guilty of the five most heinous crimes, outcasts, the underprivileged: all are utterly the substance of existence and nothing other than total bliss."
The Supreme Source - The Kunjed Gyalpo
The Fundamental Tantra of Dzogchen Semde

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Aemilius
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Joined: Sat Mar 27, 2010 11:44 am

Re: Buddhist Understanding of Emptiness.

Post by Aemilius » Thu Jun 06, 2019 9:47 am

An old thing: Car is empty of being a car. It is a car because you and other people have a need to travel, to move from one place to another place.
A french man is not a french man. An arab is not an arab. A north korean is not a north korean. A japanese is not a japanese. Their nationality identity is dependent on your, the viewer's, nationality identity. If you were a frenchman etc, you would see and perceive them differently. But nationality is what most people see as an established fact and not as an emptiness. This reality view of nationality (that is wrong) is deeply ingrained. Who would be able conquer it?
In part I got this understanding of emptiness from Maurice Merleau-Ponty, french philosopher. He talks about embodied perception, i.e. what we perceive depends on our embodiment; our body and our bodily history. E.g. if I am 60 years old, I will see 30 year olds as young. If I am 12 years old I would see them as adults!
svaha
"All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights.
They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.
Sarvē mānavāḥ svatantrāḥ samutpannāḥ vartantē api ca, gauravadr̥śā adhikāradr̥śā ca samānāḥ ēva vartantē. Ētē sarvē cētanā-tarka-śaktibhyāṁ susampannāḥ santi. Api ca, sarvē’pi bandhutva-bhāvanayā parasparaṁ vyavaharantu."
Universal Declaration of Human Rights, Article 1. (in english and sanskrit)

WesleyP
Posts: 81
Joined: Thu May 30, 2019 10:20 am

Re: Buddhist Understanding of Emptiness.

Post by WesleyP » Thu Jun 06, 2019 12:21 pm

Grigoris wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 7:46 am
WesleyP wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 7:37 am
Grigoris wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 7:22 am
All phenomena arise based (dependent) on causes and conditions, they do not exist exist due to some inherent essence or quality. They are empty of an inherent essence or quality.


Is this somehow related to the doctrine of Impermanence? . .
Yes, because all things that arise based on causes and conditions will deteriorate and cease existing at some point since the causes and conditions generally are impermanent and arise dependent on previous causes and conditions, ad nauseum.
Are causes and conditions natural forces? . .

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KathyLauren
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Re: Buddhist Understanding of Emptiness.

Post by KathyLauren » Thu Jun 06, 2019 1:03 pm

WesleyP wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 12:21 pm
Are causes and conditions natural forces? . .
Causes and conditions are just other impermanent phenomena, also empty of inherent existence.

The causes and conditions for the light in my room coming on include:
- the generator
- the fuel for the generator
- the wiring
- the voltage in the wire
- the switch being in the ON position
- my having placed the switch in the ON position
- the light bulb being serviceable
And each of those phenomena is, itself, dependent upon its own causes and condition.

Om mani padme hum
Kathy

tkp67
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Re: Buddhist Understanding of Emptiness.

Post by tkp67 » Thu Jun 06, 2019 2:16 pm

My personal and limited understanding is that the "domain" of emptiness refers to the phenomenon as they exists in MY mind and it * for me * encourages lack of self during the experience of phenomenon.

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Aemilius
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Re: Buddhist Understanding of Emptiness.

Post by Aemilius » Fri Jun 07, 2019 11:24 am

WesleyP wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 12:21 pm
Grigoris wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 7:46 am
WesleyP wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 7:37 am


Is this somehow related to the doctrine of Impermanence? . .
Yes, because all things that arise based on causes and conditions will deteriorate and cease existing at some point since the causes and conditions generally are impermanent and arise dependent on previous causes and conditions, ad nauseum.
Are causes and conditions natural forces? . .

According to the Buddha's teaching there are four kinds of conditions (pratyaya) and six kinds of causes (hetu). They encompass mind and mental states as well as material objects that are necessary for action to take place.
What are natural forces in the Indian world view at the time of Buddha or shortly after him? A difficult question, in India they conceived matter to consist of four elements, this atleast one can say. How do You see natural forces?
Plants and trees grow from seeds, they need rain or water, sunlight, and earth for growth to take place. This is mentioned by Buddha in the sutras. This may be a case of natural forces in the sutras.
svaha
"All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights.
They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.
Sarvē mānavāḥ svatantrāḥ samutpannāḥ vartantē api ca, gauravadr̥śā adhikāradr̥śā ca samānāḥ ēva vartantē. Ētē sarvē cētanā-tarka-śaktibhyāṁ susampannāḥ santi. Api ca, sarvē’pi bandhutva-bhāvanayā parasparaṁ vyavaharantu."
Universal Declaration of Human Rights, Article 1. (in english and sanskrit)

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