Best english translation of the bardo thodol?
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Best english translation of the bardo thodol?
I'm interested in hearing the opinions of the members here on which english translation of the bardo thodol is the best and why.
Re: Best english translation of the bardo thodol?
Gyurme Dorje's translation "The Tibetan Book of the Dead", with a foreword and introduction by HHDL, published by Penguin. It is the most complete version.
"My religion is not deceiving myself."
Jetsun Milarepa 1052-1135 CE
"Butchers, prostitutes, those guilty of the five most heinous crimes, outcasts, the underprivileged: all are utterly the substance of existence and nothing other than total bliss."
The Supreme Source - The Kunjed Gyalpo
The Fundamental Tantra of Dzogchen Semde
Jetsun Milarepa 1052-1135 CE
"Butchers, prostitutes, those guilty of the five most heinous crimes, outcasts, the underprivileged: all are utterly the substance of existence and nothing other than total bliss."
The Supreme Source - The Kunjed Gyalpo
The Fundamental Tantra of Dzogchen Semde
Re: Best english translation of the bardo thodol?
I would recommend Francesca Feemantle and Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche's translation..published by Shambala.
“You don’t know it. You just know about it. That is not the same thing.”
Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche to me.
Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche to me.
Re: Best english translation of the bardo thodol?
It's a decent version but it's missing lot's of sections. Actually, I am unsure which is the better (philological) translation, as I cannot read Tibetan. I'm going on content.Simon E. wrote:I would recommend Francesca Feemantle and Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche's translation..published by Shambala.
"My religion is not deceiving myself."
Jetsun Milarepa 1052-1135 CE
"Butchers, prostitutes, those guilty of the five most heinous crimes, outcasts, the underprivileged: all are utterly the substance of existence and nothing other than total bliss."
The Supreme Source - The Kunjed Gyalpo
The Fundamental Tantra of Dzogchen Semde
Jetsun Milarepa 1052-1135 CE
"Butchers, prostitutes, those guilty of the five most heinous crimes, outcasts, the underprivileged: all are utterly the substance of existence and nothing other than total bliss."
The Supreme Source - The Kunjed Gyalpo
The Fundamental Tantra of Dzogchen Semde
Re: Best english translation of the bardo thodol?
It might be Greg that no one single translation covers it all in terms of the central tenets.
“You don’t know it. You just know about it. That is not the same thing.”
Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche to me.
Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche to me.
Re: Best english translation of the bardo thodol?
I thought it was the complete version?Sherab Dorje wrote:Gyurme Dorje's translation "The Tibetan Book of the Dead", with a foreword and introduction by HHDL, published by Penguin. It is the most complete version.
Although many individuals in this age appear to be merely indulging their worldly desires, one does not have the capacity to judge them, so it is best to train in pure vision.
- Shabkar
- Shabkar
Re: Best english translation of the bardo thodol?
That's my understanding too.Pero wrote:I thought it was the complete version?Sherab Dorje wrote:Gyurme Dorje's translation "The Tibetan Book of the Dead", with a foreword and introduction by HHDL, published by Penguin. It is the most complete version.
Look at the unfathomable spinelessness of man: all the means he's been given to stay alert he uses, in the end, to ornament his sleep. – Rene Daumal
the modern mind has become so limited and single-visioned that it has lost touch with normal perception - John Michell
the modern mind has become so limited and single-visioned that it has lost touch with normal perception - John Michell
Re: Best english translation of the bardo thodol?
One of my teachers, who is a published translater himself, recommended this version.Sherab Dorje wrote:Gyurme Dorje's translation "The Tibetan Book of the Dead", with a foreword and introduction by HHDL, published by Penguin. It is the most complete version.
We abide nowhere. We possess nothing.
~Chatral Rinpoche
~Chatral Rinpoche
Re: Best english translation of the bardo thodol?
to those of you asking about Gyurme Dorje's translation "The Tibetan Book of the Dead", Yes, it is the most complete translation, to date. There is more to translate and is, as of yet, unavailable in English. WY Evans Wantz version was 3 chapters. Many drew the wrong conclusion that it was THE entire book. It was at the time IF one understands "available in English" as the pretext. Just as with many ancient texts we also need to understand often Chapters and Chapter breaks were added by the translator. Often these breaks (to allow many in the West to better understand the text) are "best guesses" of the translators and may have not been the intent of the original author. In the original text many of today's Chapter breaks did not occur. Why they were added you'd need to ask the translators. My thought it to maintain the flow of the perceived short-attention spanned reader in the West. Who knows? We also need to remember our own personal understanding of the definition of ANY given word, may or may not be the understanding of the definition of the given translator. And IF the translator translated it correctly is also often in question as evidenced in the numerous different word terms used by a variety of translators. There is no translation that is 100% accurate. Many also fall into error building a belief system around their own error filled definition of a given word. Ancient saying, "Most, (I add, if not all) or what passes for religion is man projecting his own image onto his "god" (read previous sentence to understand this misunderstood three letter word) and worshiping himself (the image he has of his own error filled belief system).
Re: Best english translation of the bardo thodol?
In this case the chapter breaks and chapters are in the original text as written down by Karma Lingpa.rleebaker wrote: Just as with many ancient texts we also need to understand often Chapters and Chapter breaks were added by the translator.
Re: Best english translation of the bardo thodol?
What about the new translation done by Elio Guarisco The Tibetan Book of the Dead: Awakening Upon Dying?
Has anybody read it? Any thoughts about it?
Has anybody read it? Any thoughts about it?
Life is great and death has to be just as great as life.
- Mike Tyson
People not only don't know what's happening to them, they don't even know that they don't know.
- Noam Chomsky
- Mike Tyson
People not only don't know what's happening to them, they don't even know that they don't know.
- Noam Chomsky
Re: Best english translation of the bardo thodol?
W Y Evans Wentz. The original Enligsh translation, nothing beats that one.
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Re: Best english translation of the bardo thodol?
WuMing wrote:What about the new translation done by Elio Guarisco The Tibetan Book of the Dead: Awakening Upon Dying?
Has anybody read it? Any thoughts about it?
I really loved it personally. I have no idea about the accuracy of translation or anything, but I thought this edition was wonderful...mainly for the act that it includes a sizeable chunk of commentary and explanatory material from ChNN, and is presented in a Dzogchen context. My only previous experience was with the Trungpa/Fremantle version.
Meditate upon Bodhicitta when afflicted by disease
Meditate upon Bodhicitta when sad
Meditate upon Bodhicitta when suffering occurs
Meditate upon Bodhicitta when you are scared
-Khunu Lama
Meditate upon Bodhicitta when sad
Meditate upon Bodhicitta when suffering occurs
Meditate upon Bodhicitta when you are scared
-Khunu Lama
Re: Best english translation of the bardo thodol?
surely you are kidding,odysseus wrote:W Y Evans Wentz. The original Enligsh translation, nothing beats that one.
Re: Best english translation of the bardo thodol?
Johnny Dangerous wrote:WuMing wrote:What about the new translation done by Elio Guarisco The Tibetan Book of the Dead: Awakening Upon Dying?
Has anybody read it? Any thoughts about it?
I really loved it personally. I have no idea about the accuracy of translation or anything, but I thought this edition was wonderful...mainly for the act that it includes a sizeable chunk of commentary and explanatory material from ChNN, and is presented in a Dzogchen context. My only previous experience was with the Trungpa/Fremantle version.
The Bardo Thos grol is Dzogchen through and through
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Re: Best english translation of the bardo thodol?
I know this now.Malcolm wrote:Johnny Dangerous wrote:WuMing wrote:What about the new translation done by Elio Guarisco The Tibetan Book of the Dead: Awakening Upon Dying?
Has anybody read it? Any thoughts about it?
I really loved it personally. I have no idea about the accuracy of translation or anything, but I thought this edition was wonderful...mainly for the act that it includes a sizeable chunk of commentary and explanatory material from ChNN, and is presented in a Dzogchen context. My only previous experience was with the Trungpa/Fremantle version.
The Bardo Thos grol is Dzogchen through and through
Meditate upon Bodhicitta when afflicted by disease
Meditate upon Bodhicitta when sad
Meditate upon Bodhicitta when suffering occurs
Meditate upon Bodhicitta when you are scared
-Khunu Lama
Meditate upon Bodhicitta when sad
Meditate upon Bodhicitta when suffering occurs
Meditate upon Bodhicitta when you are scared
-Khunu Lama
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Re: Best english translation of the bardo thodol?
It might be interesting to read the foreword of 'Self-Liberation Through Seeing with Naked Awareness' by ChNN:odysseus wrote:W Y Evans Wentz. The original Enligsh translation, nothing beats that one.
https://books.google.at/books?id=dy0tDQ ... &q&f=false
It clearly sais that this is not the case.
Re: Best english translation of the bardo thodol?
No, actually this is my first reading! It has a charming attitude of old English understanding. I don't even know if there is anything better.Malcolm wrote:surely you are kidding,odysseus wrote:W Y Evans Wentz. The original Enligsh translation, nothing beats that one.
Re: Best english translation of the bardo thodol?
It has the charming attitude of being completely wrong in so many ways.odysseus wrote:No, actually this is my first reading! It has a charming attitude of old English understanding. I don't even know if there is anything better.Malcolm wrote:surely you are kidding,odysseus wrote:W Y Evans Wentz. The original Enligsh translation, nothing beats that one.
Re: Best english translation of the bardo thodol?
Additionally, I believe it's in that book, John Reynolds has an afterwards that breaks down some of Evans-Wentz's serious and varied misunderstandings of the book and the teaching and some of the history and perspective of Evans-Wentz.HandsomeMonkeyking wrote:It might be interesting to read the foreword of 'Self-Liberation Through Seeing with Naked Awareness' by ChNN:odysseus wrote:W Y Evans Wentz. The original Enligsh translation, nothing beats that one.
https://books.google.at/books?id=dy0tDQ ... &q&f=false
It clearly sais that this is not the case.
"Death's second name is 'omnipresent.' On the relative truth it seems we become separate. But on the absolute there is no separation." Lama Dawa