sem-ngo tropa ?

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kirtu
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sem-ngo tropa ?

Post by kirtu » Sat Jul 29, 2017 10:29 pm

The equivalent to kensho in TB is known as sem-ngo tropa.
A well-know translator mentioned the above to me.

Of course it has to be something like sems ngo tropa to start with. But the Thlib Translation Tool does not recognize "tropa". However the THL transcription semngo tröpa = THL transliteration sems ngo sprod pa/ = སེམས་ངོ་སྤྲོད་པ . But this is usually translated as "gave mind transmission" and maybe "[gave]pointing out" too.

One dictionary gives ་ངོ་སྤྲོད་པ་ as
introduction, direct introduction; to point out, introduce, bring face to face; direct introduction, pointing out; to introduce, point out directly; to give pointing out instructions, introduce the nature of mind.
TH ངོ་སྤྲོད་ = identify, introduce, point out

So if one accepts "identify" above, could སེམས་ངོ་སྤྲོད་པ also mean "one who identifies the nature of mind", with སེམས in this context meaning nature of mind or mind essence rather than defiled discursive mind?

I did respond to the translator with a few questions and am waiting to hear back but I hope that experts here could help illuminate the term. In what contexts is this term usually used, etc.?

Thanks in advance!

Kirt
Kirt's Tibetan Translation Notes

"Even if you practice only for an hour a day with faith and inspiration, good qualities will steadily increase. Regular practice makes it easy to transform your mind. From seeing only relative truth, you will eventually reach a profound certainty in the meaning of absolute truth."
Kyabje Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche.

"Only you can make your mind beautiful."
HH Chetsang Rinpoche

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kirtu
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Re: sem-ngo tropa ?

Post by kirtu » Sun Jul 30, 2017 12:08 am

kirtu wrote: with སེམས in this context meaning nature of mind or mind essence rather than defiled discursive mind?
I was going to change this but went over the editing limit ....

So
with སེམས་ངོ as nature of mind.
If so then the term may be like a compound word སེམས་ངོ་ + ངོ་སྤྲོད་ + པ་ => སེམས་ངོ་སྤྲོད་པ = (in this case) one who identifies/identified the nature of mind which is like kensho.

Kirt
Kirt's Tibetan Translation Notes

"Even if you practice only for an hour a day with faith and inspiration, good qualities will steadily increase. Regular practice makes it easy to transform your mind. From seeing only relative truth, you will eventually reach a profound certainty in the meaning of absolute truth."
Kyabje Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche.

"Only you can make your mind beautiful."
HH Chetsang Rinpoche

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dzogchungpa
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Re: sem-ngo tropa ?

Post by dzogchungpa » Sun Jul 30, 2017 1:17 am

There is not only nothingness because there is always, and always can manifest. - Thinley Norbu Rinpoche

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kirtu
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Re: sem-ngo tropa ?

Post by kirtu » Sun Jul 30, 2017 1:40 am

dzogchungpa wrote:How about sems ngo 'phrod pa?
I had seen sems ngo 'phrod while I was researching the above and it looked promising but the Ranjung Yeshe Online Dharma Dictionary didn't have sems ngo 'phrod pa ( it just listed sems ngo 'phrod and sems ngo 'phrod song pas). And then the tie-in with sems rtogs pa !

Thanks!

Kirt
Kirt's Tibetan Translation Notes

"Even if you practice only for an hour a day with faith and inspiration, good qualities will steadily increase. Regular practice makes it easy to transform your mind. From seeing only relative truth, you will eventually reach a profound certainty in the meaning of absolute truth."
Kyabje Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche.

"Only you can make your mind beautiful."
HH Chetsang Rinpoche

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Malcolm
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Re: sem-ngo tropa ?

Post by Malcolm » Sun Jul 30, 2017 3:34 pm

kirtu wrote:
dzogchungpa wrote:How about sems ngo 'phrod pa?
I had seen sems ngo 'phrod while I was researching the above and it looked promising but the Ranjung Yeshe Online Dharma Dictionary didn't have sems ngo 'phrod pa ( it just listed sems ngo 'phrod and sems ngo 'phrod song pas). And then the tie-in with sems rtogs pa !

Thanks!

Kirt

What Eric PK meant was that the experience of Kensho and the experience of introducing the mind is the same experience. The difference of course is that the latter is a discovery, the former is an introduction.
Buddhahood in This Life
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


[A]nything at all that is well spoken is the word of the Buddha.

-- Ārya-adhyāśaya-sañcodana-nāma-mahāyāna-sūtra

The different sūtras in accord with the emptiness
taught by the Sugata are definitive in meaning;
One can understand that all of those Dharmas in
which a sentient being, individual, or person are taught are provisional in meaning.

-- Samadhirāja Sūtra

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