Aemilius wrote:conebeckham wrote:Tulku Urgyen said that one can achieve enlightenment through practicing solely the completion stage, but not through solely practicing the creation stage
Which leads us to the conclusion that one does not need to be "awakened" prior to practicing the completion stage. I rest my case.
In the Tantra generally after initiation you should consider yourself as already enlightened. You "become enlightened" by maintaining this awareness (that you are enlightened), this is one explanation of the tantric method. It seems that most people can't really feel that they are enlightened though they have received tantric initiation. They still want to "become enlightened" although they have been told in the initiation that they are enlightened. Now they go so far that they start arguing by which means they could "become enlightened" !? -enlightened still or enlightened again ??
Yes, all beings are enlightened.
But can you handle your own negative emotions, difficulties in life and pain of sickness or death just by thinking 'I am enlightened, I am enlightened?' At least I know I can not.
In initiation we were introduced that we are pure from the beginning. We should keep that view in mind. But that actually doesn't influence our argue here. Thinking that our true nature is already enlightened is not cheating, it's the fact; but thinking that you don't need to follow the path step by step is cheating yourself.
Generation stage is also called 'stage of example'. The face, arms and objects you visualised are an example of your ture nature, but it's not the true nature. Why? because you visualised with your mind (sems), and real wisdom is beyond that. Generation stage is a good training to make you closer to the real situation; but just by creating a diety or a mandala by your mind won't directly lead you to real enlightenment.
To make it clearer: thinking yourself is enlightened won't make you really enlightened, because enlightenment is beyond thinking. Before one really experiences nature of mind, one can always say that his nature of mind is originally liberated etc, but that won't help him much.
If you only practice generation stage, you will still get siddhi, you will be able to be reborn in diety's pureland, or you might have chance to be liberated after you die. Still quite good.