Of course you can read up on the theory and practice of Vajrayana Buddhism on your own. No problem. There're loads of books and all sorts of sources on-line. I think it's very intelligent to first suss out the system intellectually before jumping into practice. It's the practice that you need a live Teacher for. 
If you want to give this a serious try I would like to recommend this http://www.dharmasun.org/index.php?dharmasun=cms&id=3" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;Padme wrote:I don't know.... People told me the same thing with the violin. No teachers nearby; I had never played a musical instrument, and didn't even know how to read music. People said "You can't do this without a teacher, you should have started this as a child, it's a fretless instrument, it's very difficult", etc., and you know what? I taught myself how to read music, and I taught myself the violin and learned the notes by ear. It took me YEARS, but now I can play both classical pieces and celtic fiddle, and quite well, all without a teacher or lessons. So I have a hard time when someone I "can't" do something on my own.... It's not like I want to be Lama; claiming to be an expert and showing others. I just want to learn more about the practice for enrichment and study. Of course it's much more difficult without a teacher, but I never asked if it was okay if I do this, that's between me and my heart. I was just asking for learning resources. I don't see anything wrong with earnest home study & practice, as long as I'm not out there teaching others or claiming to be an expert based on what I learn from home. And I certainly do intend to travel to occasional retreats, etc.; I just don't have a nearby teacher. I don't even know if this is the tradition for me yet, I am simply trying to learn more about it, the reasons for the rituals, etc.
Incidentally, I recently wrote to Robert Thurman and told him of my isolated situation and my desire to learn more about the Tibetan tradition and he didn't make any attempt to dissuade me. He wrote back with some suggested readings and gave me some very sincere advice, none of which was "don't attempt this". I hold him in high esteem, so while I appreciate and respect the opinions of a couple of you that suggested against this, I don't think there's anything wrong with trying to learn more about this practice on my own, with the assistance of reading, reputable websites and input from others about practice.
Also, to be clear: I'm not asking for references on the rituals, etc so I can arbitrarily mimic them, I'm asking about what the rituals are so I can study WHY they perform them. That's all to understand the principals of the fundamentals to determine IF it's even something I want to pursue as personal practice.
Thanks to all for the book references and home study course links so far!
heart wrote:
If you want to give this a serious try I would like to recommend this http://www.dharmasun.org/index.php?dharmasun=cms&id=3" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
/magnus
Looks great!How about going on a residential retreat?Padme wrote: So I'm kind of on my own in this venture. There really is no "community involvement", I wish there were! I'm trying not to let that fact get me down. Some (on another forum) said I can't do this without a teacher, or at least a Sangha, but others have said that's silly and that of course I can. I do know that I am really relying a lot from books and the internet for most of my knowledge.
Hi Hayagriva,Hayagriva wrote:I want to also recommend Dharma Sun. Chokyi Nyima Rinpoche is an excellent teacher and very keen on his students becoming both scholars AND yogis.
How about going on a residential retreat?Padme wrote: So I'm kind of on my own in this venture. There really is no "community involvement", I wish there were! I'm trying not to let that fact get me down. Some (on another forum) said I can't do this without a teacher, or at least a Sangha, but others have said that's silly and that of course I can. I do know that I am really relying a lot from books and the internet for most of my knowledge.
Hi Padme, that makes sense, and I never meant to discourage you from sincerely studying books and study courses, etc. from your own home to develop an overview. That sounds great. I was just pointing out that from a Vajrayana point of view-- what the tradition itself says-- is that until one receives the wang, lung, and tri = the empowerment, oral transmission, and individually-catered instructions, from a qualified Lama then the Vajrayana sadhanas themselves will generally not bear any fruit. At the very least, one needs the permission from a Lama to begin a practice, and the oral transmission. But these restrictions mainly are around Vajrayana level practice, and even so there are still some mantras and activities that are considered beneficial to everyone regardless of transmission simply through the vastness of their power. However, receiving lung for these will still bring a much more powerful effect. Among these would be the mantra of Chenrezi "Om Mani Padme Hung", which is considered the essence of compassion for instance.Padme wrote: Of course it's much more difficult without a teacher, but I never asked if it was okay if I do this, that's between me and my heart. I was just asking for learning resources. I don't see anything wrong with earnest home study & practice, as long as I'm not out there teaching others or claiming to be an expert based on what I learn from home. And I certainly do intend to travel to occasional retreats, etc.; I just don't have a nearby teacher. I don't even know if this is the tradition for me yet, I am simply trying to learn more about it, the reasons for the rituals, etc.
Incidentally, I recently wrote to Robert Thurman and told him of my isolated situation and my desire to learn more about the Tibetan tradition and he didn't make any attempt to dissuade me. He wrote back with some suggested readings and gave me some very sincere advice, none of which was "don't attempt this". I hold him in high esteem, so while I appreciate and respect the opinions of a couple of you that suggested against this, I don't think there's anything wrong with trying to learn more about this practice on my own, with the assistance of reading, reputable websites and input from others about practice.
Also, to be clear: I'm not asking for references on the rituals, etc so I can arbitrarily mimic them, I'm asking about what the rituals are so I can study WHY they perform them. That's all to understand the principals of the fundamentals to determine IF it's even something I want to pursue as personal practice.
Tibetan Buddhism generally is Mahayana Buddhism, which includes sutra level teachings and practices of the Mahayana, as well as the Vinaya codes of outward conduct for monastics.. but a predominant aspect of Tibetan Buddhism is that it specializes in the 'skillful means' path of transformation known as Vajrayana, or Buddhist Tantra, which is said to be the natural progression of the Mahayana. When you say "Tibetan Rituals", in your title, most people will interpret this to be Vajrayana, because most of what from the outside appears to be "ritual" in Tibetan Buddhism are actually practices of the most profound Vajrayana.Padme wrote:That reminds me, I meant to say this earlier. I keep seeing the word Vajrayana being used, but I never used that word. From what I understand Vajrayana is a form, the core perhaps, of Tibetan Buddhism, but not all Tibetan Buddhism is to the Vajrayana degree. Is that not correct? My understanding was that Vajrayana is a much more intense form, using tantric practices, etc., that not all Tibetan Buddhism practices. Maybe I am wrong on this. If anyone has any links, references, etc on the differences I would like to read them. I have been speaking this whole time on "general Tibetan buddhism", if there is such a thing, and not even referring to Vajrayana.
Well, that explains it. My mistake for using improper or misleading terminology. I just assumed that there were some general "rituals" (my interpretation of that word) in Tibetan Buddhism (non Vajrayana) such as prayers for the dying, celebrating special holidays, etc. For example, when I think of Catholic communion, with the wafers and wine, I think of that as a ritual, although I certainly don't associate it with Vajrayana! So I guess I'm using the word improperly, or maybe just too literally.Adamantine wrote:Tibetan Buddhism generally is Mahayana Buddhism, which includes sutra level teachings and practices of the Mahayana, as well as the Vinaya codes of outward conduct for monastics.. but a predominant aspect of Tibetan Buddhism is that it specializes in the 'skillful means' path of transformation known as Vajrayana, or Buddhist Tantra, which is said to be the natural progression of the Mahayana. When you say "Tibetan Rituals", in your title, most people will interpret this to be Vajrayana, because most of what from the outside appears to be "ritual" in Tibetan Buddhism are actually practices of the most profound Vajrayana.Padme wrote:That reminds me, I meant to say this earlier. I keep seeing the word Vajrayana being used, but I never used that word. From what I understand Vajrayana is a form, the core perhaps, of Tibetan Buddhism, but not all Tibetan Buddhism is to the Vajrayana degree. Is that not correct? My understanding was that Vajrayana is a much more intense form, using tantric practices, etc., that not all Tibetan Buddhism practices. Maybe I am wrong on this. If anyone has any links, references, etc on the differences I would like to read them. I have been speaking this whole time on "general Tibetan buddhism", if there is such a thing, and not even referring to Vajrayana.
Seconded.Namdrol wrote:Just attend a webcast by Chogyal Namkhai Norbu. Then you will have plenty to practice.
Yeah that's a great resource for anyone in the isolated conditions you've described: these webcasts are live teachings so despite distance you are essentially getting transmission, thought it's of course preferable to be with a teacher in person-- this is in any case far better than pre-recorded teachings because you are synchronized in time, if not in place.Nangwa wrote:Seconded.Namdrol wrote:Just attend a webcast by Chogyal Namkhai Norbu. Then you will have plenty to practice.
Not all Vajrayana is Tibetan - there is the Shingon school in Japan, for instance.Padme wrote:Why is there a Mahayana section and a Tibetan section? Why not just call the Tibetan section Vajrayana if it's so predominant? I guess I need to do a little more reading to figure out if I'm trying to learn about Tibetan Buddhism or Mahayana Buddhism. Darnit, just when I think I'm learning something, I get thrown a curve ball!
Right, but isn't is also true that not all Tibetan is Vajrayana? That's what I'm trying to understand. I thought I was trying to find out about Tibetan Buddhism in general, not necessarily Vajrayana. There are Tibetan Buddhists who do not practice Vajrayana, aren't there?Hayagriva wrote:Not all Vajrayana is Tibetan - there is the Shingon school in Japan, for instance.Padme wrote:Why is there a Mahayana section and a Tibetan section? Why not just call the Tibetan section Vajrayana if it's so predominant? I guess I need to do a little more reading to figure out if I'm trying to learn about Tibetan Buddhism or Mahayana Buddhism. Darnit, just when I think I'm learning something, I get thrown a curve ball!
No.Padme wrote:Right, but isn't is also true that not all Tibetan is Vajrayana? That's what I'm trying to understand. I thought I was trying to find out about Tibetan Buddhism in general, not necessarily Vajrayana. There are Tibetan Buddhists who do not practice Vajrayana, aren't there?Hayagriva wrote:Not all Vajrayana is Tibetan - there is the Shingon school in Japan, for instance.Padme wrote:Why is there a Mahayana section and a Tibetan section? Why not just call the Tibetan section Vajrayana if it's so predominant? I guess I need to do a little more reading to figure out if I'm trying to learn about Tibetan Buddhism or Mahayana Buddhism. Darnit, just when I think I'm learning something, I get thrown a curve ball!
Yes. Vajrayana is not practised by all Tibetan Buddhists, but sections of all three levels of teaching are practised in the Tibetan lineages. For example the Vinaya followed by Tibetan monastics is actually a hinayana one - Mulasarvastivada.Padme wrote:Right, but isn't is also true that not all Tibetan is Vajrayana? That's what I'm trying to understand. I thought I was trying to find out about Tibetan Buddhism in general, not necessarily Vajrayana. There are Tibetan Buddhists who do not practice Vajrayana, aren't there?Hayagriva wrote:Not all Vajrayana is Tibetan - there is the Shingon school in Japan, for instance.Padme wrote:Why is there a Mahayana section and a Tibetan section? Why not just call the Tibetan section Vajrayana if it's so predominant? I guess I need to do a little more reading to figure out if I'm trying to learn about Tibetan Buddhism or Mahayana Buddhism. Darnit, just when I think I'm learning something, I get thrown a curve ball!
Like I said, Theravada, Mahayana and Vajrayana is and was studied and practiced in Tibet. But I never heard of anyone not practicing Vajrayana in Tibet.Hayagriva wrote:Yes. Vajrayana is not practised by all Tibetan Buddhists, but sections of all three levels of teaching are practised in the Tibetan lineages. For example the Vinaya followed by Tibetan monastics is actually a hinayana one - Mulasarvastivada.Padme wrote:
Right, but isn't is also true that not all Tibetan is Vajrayana? That's what I'm trying to understand. I thought I was trying to find out about Tibetan Buddhism in general, not necessarily Vajrayana. There are Tibetan Buddhists who do not practice Vajrayana, aren't there?
