All is One

White Lotus
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Re: All is One

Post by White Lotus » Mon Dec 18, 2017 9:17 pm

Thanks Motova. I no longer believe in the six senses. Mind/perception/this is too complex. I don't have a proliferation of experiences and concept's'. Only 1. But your's is a very very good answer. :namaste:
in any matters of importance. dont rely on me. i may not know what i am talking about. take what i say as mere speculation. i am not ordained. nor do i have a formal training. i do believe though that if i am wrong on any point. there are those on this site who i hope will quickly point out my mistakes.

DGA
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Re: All is One

Post by DGA » Mon Dec 18, 2017 9:32 pm

There are ways in which this thread is just sad.

I have nothing more to add than this:

viewtopic.php?f=39&t=27114

odysseus
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Re: All is One

Post by odysseus » Mon Dec 18, 2017 10:26 pm

If someone says to you "All is one" then you can ask back "One what?". It's a Zen riddle.

White Lotus
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Re: All is One

Post by White Lotus » Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:17 pm

I just wanted to clarify: the 6 senses are mutable and don't reach ideal 1, but point towards it. The senses are however immanently 1. But, ultimately transcendent 1 and immanent 1 are just 1. In order to appreciate 1 you need to transcend the senses. The intellect is the best tool for reaching out towards 1. I hope i am not wasting you'r time. Tom. :namaste:
in any matters of importance. dont rely on me. i may not know what i am talking about. take what i say as mere speculation. i am not ordained. nor do i have a formal training. i do believe though that if i am wrong on any point. there are those on this site who i hope will quickly point out my mistakes.

White Lotus
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Joined: Sat Jan 23, 2010 12:56 pm

Re: All is One

Post by White Lotus » Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:23 pm

One what? One. :smile: perhaps now is the time to end this thread.
in any matters of importance. dont rely on me. i may not know what i am talking about. take what i say as mere speculation. i am not ordained. nor do i have a formal training. i do believe though that if i am wrong on any point. there are those on this site who i hope will quickly point out my mistakes.

odysseus
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Re: All is One

Post by odysseus » Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:52 pm

White Lotus wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:23 pm
One what? One. :smile: perhaps now is the time to end this thread.
Yeah, one what? Please define "one" and "what is what". :namaste:

amanitamusc
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Re: All is One

Post by amanitamusc » Tue Dec 19, 2017 2:26 am

Your numba wawn WL.

DGA
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Re: All is One

Post by DGA » Tue Dec 19, 2017 2:33 am

White Lotus wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:17 pm
I just wanted to clarify: the 6 senses are mutable and don't reach ideal 1, but point towards it. The senses are however immanently 1. But, ultimately transcendent 1 and immanent 1 are just 1. In order to appreciate 1 you need to transcend the senses. The intellect is the best tool for reaching out towards 1. I hope i am not wasting you'r time. Tom. :namaste:
Respectfully and in a spirit of friendship:

All the statements you have made about One are examples of prapanca. They are just a proliferation of concepts. If your intention is to build up a nest of concepts to live in, then prapanca is fine. If your goal is liberation, then concepts like "one" and "many" won't help you. Learning Dharma from a teacher, contemplating it with care, and practicing it with consistency will help you.

Taking refuge in concepts you make up for yourself is the same as taking refuge in samsara. It's what my grandmother used to call "believing your own bullshit." She was right. Here's a verse that is recited at Tendai Buddhist Institute that I think is most appropriate:
Let me respectfully remind you: Life and death are of supreme importance. Time swiftly passes by and opportunity is lost. Each of us now must awaken. Awaken! Take heed! Do not squander your life!
I hope this is helpful to you. Seriously:

viewtopic.php?f=39&t=27114

boda
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Re: All is One

Post by boda » Tue Dec 19, 2017 4:24 am

All the statements you have made about One are examples of prapanca. They are just a proliferation of concepts. If your intention is to build up a nest of concepts to live in, then prapanca is fine. If your goal is liberation, then concepts like "one" and "many" won't help you. Learning Dharma from a teacher, contemplating it with care, and practicing it with consistency will help you.
Yeah, a teachers nest of concepts are the best! :cheers:

muni
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Re: All is One

Post by muni » Tue Dec 19, 2017 10:31 am

Apologize to disturb this tread. At least this is not in the limitations of tradition. I just see that one and there is teaching by kindness in which one is somehow explained.

Not sure this agrees with what is expressed here, but at least thoughts' formed ideation or formed interpretations about whatever perceived will never bring any clarity. As here explained as well by Jetsunma:

Last edited by muni on Tue Dec 19, 2017 10:36 am, edited 4 times in total.
:meditate:

White Lotus
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Re: All is One

Post by White Lotus » Tue Dec 19, 2017 10:33 am

Thank you DGA. If any concept held other than direct experience is prapanca then i appear to be guilty of prapanca. (this is because though i love perception it is no longer satisfying) If you consider what i am saying though you may see that i have uttered only one word. One. I don't see that as a proliferation of words. The buddha uttered one word too: emptiness. I have a saying: "The One returns to emptiness. Where does emptiness return? Emptiness returns to the One". Its a process of mutual giving and receiving, receiving and giving. In Zen one must slay even the buddhas and patriarchs. Go beyond. I just follow the Zen path wherever it leads like a dead leaf blown in the wind. :thanks:
in any matters of importance. dont rely on me. i may not know what i am talking about. take what i say as mere speculation. i am not ordained. nor do i have a formal training. i do believe though that if i am wrong on any point. there are those on this site who i hope will quickly point out my mistakes.

White Lotus
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Joined: Sat Jan 23, 2010 12:56 pm

Re: All is One

Post by White Lotus » Tue Dec 19, 2017 10:58 am

Please Odysius, don,t ask such complex questions! Its too early in the morning. Lets just say that 1 is 1. The cleverer we are the less we understand. Go ask a child what 1 is, but please don't ask me! :rolleye:
in any matters of importance. dont rely on me. i may not know what i am talking about. take what i say as mere speculation. i am not ordained. nor do i have a formal training. i do believe though that if i am wrong on any point. there are those on this site who i hope will quickly point out my mistakes.

Simon E.
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Re: All is One

Post by Simon E. » Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:09 am

We are wasting our time. Simply feeding a prapanca machine that uses all input to churn out more prapanca.

I'm out.
Back to fishin' folks... :namaste:

White Lotus
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Re: All is One

Post by White Lotus » Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:17 am

Simon, Thanks for you'r advice about prapanca. :anjali: and Muni are thoughts prapanca?
in any matters of importance. dont rely on me. i may not know what i am talking about. take what i say as mere speculation. i am not ordained. nor do i have a formal training. i do believe though that if i am wrong on any point. there are those on this site who i hope will quickly point out my mistakes.

muni
Posts: 4532
Joined: Fri Apr 17, 2009 6:59 am

Re: All is One

Post by muni » Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:26 am

I am prapanca. Thoughts can be used, not as Jetsunma explains to be caught up by them by grasping to them, and so automatically identifying with them and trusting them, then they are distraction only, then they are using "us", "our" world.

Moon reflection in water, so is all a reflection of empty mind. When I start to analyse the moon reflection, I cut appearance and emptiness in two. Then your 1 is gone.

Ah peace.
:meditate:

Simon E.
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Re: All is One

Post by Simon E. » Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:43 am

:popcorn:
Back to fishin' folks... :namaste:

muni
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Joined: Fri Apr 17, 2009 6:59 am

Re: All is One

Post by muni » Tue Dec 19, 2017 12:00 pm

Simon E. wrote:
Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:43 am
:popcorn:
Take a drink by it. :cheers: You are going for another round?
:meditate:

White Lotus
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Re: All is One

Post by White Lotus » Tue Dec 19, 2017 1:50 pm

Dear Odyssious the only definition of 1 i can come up with is: 1. You can't say what is Truth?: truth, because it is compound. Ultimately 1 is not, it is just 1. If you elaborate you loose it. It's utterly simplex. That was a tough question.
in any matters of importance. dont rely on me. i may not know what i am talking about. take what i say as mere speculation. i am not ordained. nor do i have a formal training. i do believe though that if i am wrong on any point. there are those on this site who i hope will quickly point out my mistakes.

White Lotus
Posts: 1173
Joined: Sat Jan 23, 2010 12:56 pm

Re: All is One

Post by White Lotus » Tue Dec 19, 2017 2:49 pm

Muni, the sun reflects in many puddles after the rain clouds have gone. The sun is the ideal 1. The reflections are inspired by it. Each reflection is perfectly 1. Empty 1's. Emptiness is 1.
in any matters of importance. dont rely on me. i may not know what i am talking about. take what i say as mere speculation. i am not ordained. nor do i have a formal training. i do believe though that if i am wrong on any point. there are those on this site who i hope will quickly point out my mistakes.

White Lotus
Posts: 1173
Joined: Sat Jan 23, 2010 12:56 pm

Re: All is One

Post by White Lotus » Tue Dec 19, 2017 6:26 pm

Muni, "i am" is prapanca because it is a thought we can attach to and so reinforce ego conceit? Any attaching reinforces ego? :namaste:
in any matters of importance. dont rely on me. i may not know what i am talking about. take what i say as mere speculation. i am not ordained. nor do i have a formal training. i do believe though that if i am wrong on any point. there are those on this site who i hope will quickly point out my mistakes.

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