Guan Yin Citta Dharma Door

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cjdevries
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Guan Yin Citta Dharma Door

Post by cjdevries » Sun Apr 26, 2015 12:11 am

Has anyone here practiced the Guan Yin Citta Dharma Door, taught by Master Lu Junhong? http://guanyincitta.com/en/

I have used the practice for awhile (which mostly consists of reciting a variety of sutras and praying to Kwan Yin) and have definitely had benefits. I was working with a qigong master who had become a disciple of Master Lu and I had a good experience with her. But I was wondering what someone else might think of the practice. Apparently, quite a few people have improved from severe mental and physical health issues by practicing life liberation (releasing fish or crabs), making vows (such as vegetarianism), and reciting "little houses." Has anyone else heard of this practice through others (I know it's become popular in parts of Asia and Australia)?

I think a lot of people come to it from a place of desperation (e.g. incurable illness) and some have experienced good improvement or recovery. But has anyone heard of negative experiences? or people that have gotten a bad impression?

The simplest part of the practice is doing life liberation (crab release or fish release) and I have really enjoyed that part of it. But there are parts of the practice (little houses) that have been controversial with my family. Little houses are small cards with bubbles that count how many mantras you recite (Heart Sutra, etc.). There is a brief ceremony where you pray to Kwan Yin Bodhisattva and ask for help in healing or resolving issues in your life, or clearing heavy karmic burden.

Personally, I've had good experience and have had mental and physical benefits. They have helped me through an "incurable" illness and definitely improved my quality of life.
But I can understand how something this could be controversial too. I just wanted to see if there was anyone out there that had heard of this practice or had experiences of their own.

plwk
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Re: Guan Yin Citta Dharma Door

Post by plwk » Sun Apr 26, 2015 2:59 am

Some stuff here... 1 2 3 and them

cjdevries
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Re: Guan Yin Citta Dharma Door

Post by cjdevries » Sun Apr 26, 2015 4:13 am

It is good to read these and this info, and it definitely makes me want to approach things with great care. I've had some good results, and I know of a lot of people that have really benefited from the practice. But I definitely understand the concerns. My qigong teacher told me that it had to be undertaken with a lot of care; it is a time-consuming and somewhat complex practice. I still feel that it's a useful tool and I believe Master Lu JunHong to be genuine and I think he really helps others. I hope it's just a case of the practice and the teacher being misunderstood, but I think everyone has to be careful and do what feels right to them. For that reason, and because the practice is complex, I wouldn't go around recommending it to everyone. However, I would recommend it to those who feel like they have exhausted other possibilities. It's a free practice, and I know it can be beneficial for those with serious health challenges, because it has benefited me. At any rate, i am fairly sure that Master Lu is not running around making a lot of money from this work.

My main practice has been Nyingma lineage Tibetan Buddhism so I think I will focus on that and continue to use the Guan Yin Citta for serious issues- but I will definitely continue to check in and monitor what is written. If I heard stories of people really having bad experiences I would think twice and probably drop the practice all together. However, I haven't heard a lot of people talk about negative experience that have tried the practice. I am still interested to hear of peoples experiences with the practice (those that have tried it). That would help me to decide if this is something I should continue with going forward.

cjdevries
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Re: Guan Yin Citta Dharma Door

Post by cjdevries » Sun Apr 26, 2015 5:10 pm

Recently, I have heard several teachers talk about "spirit harm" or "yin beings" as the possible root cause of many illness ( for example some forms of schizophrenia, cancer, etc). One was Lama Zopa Rinpoche and the other was the abbot of Lu Mountain Temple in Rosemead, CA, who was a close disciple of Master Hsuan Hua. The lecture at Lu Mountain Temple talked about having to repay karmic creditors (debts from past & present lives), perhaps people we have killed in a past war or accident. I''m not sure if Hsuan Hua also promoted or supported this idea of paying back karmic creditors in order to alleviate illness and difficulty. This seems to be the same principle presented by Guan Yin Citta; reciting mantras to transfer merit and send energy to creditors that are lingering around, causing mental or physical disease. The topic of yin beings or spirit harm seems highly controversial, but I think it's something that is possible and should be considered in certain cases. I know Tibetan Buddhism has the Sengdongma or Senge droma practice for alleviating spirit harm as well.

Here is a link to Lama Zopa Rinpoche responding to questions about loved ones with schizophrenia. He briefly touches on spirit harm- related to harming beings in the past he says:

http://www.lamayeshe.com/index.php?sect ... &chid=1248

cjdevries
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Re: Guan Yin Citta Dharma Door

Post by cjdevries » Mon Jun 01, 2015 3:39 am

The teacher I learned the practice from recently told me that she found that burning the little houses can attract more spirits/energy requesters. She has found that offering the little houses without burning them still seems to be effective without the added side effect of attracting other beings. I have found benefit in the practice, it has helped to increase my energy while dealing with a serious illness and I would still recommend the practice to anyone suffering from serious illness or mental illness. At the same time, I am still cautious about the whole thing- while it continues to benefit me, I will continue.

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Boomerang
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Re: Guan Yin Citta Dharma Door

Post by Boomerang » Sun Jun 14, 2015 3:42 pm

I have a bad feeling about this. They may claim that these spirits are Buddhist, but that doesn't make it true. A page on their website says that if you break your vows you will suffer karmic retribution, whatever that means. I've seen an organization like this once before, but it was smaller. They had a little paper burning ritual, promised magic powers from spirits, and promoted questionable views. Bad mojo, dude.

If I were you I wouldn't want to make nebulous contracts with spirits I know nothing about. It's better to rely on a respected lineage.
"All the suffering of the lower realms, whatever difficulty and unhappiness we may experience as human beings, as well as every other possible suffering of the three realms of existence, have their origin in cherishing ourselves more than others."

Saoshun
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Re: Guan Yin Citta Dharma Door

Post by Saoshun » Sun Jun 14, 2015 5:17 pm

Can someone post just list of practices or straight links for it?

Working with spirits, petition papers and all that is pretty usual for that region and culture of buddhism.

There are even such things in orthodox christianity really this approach to curing different things like alcoholism etc. if someone broke those vows like here it goes thru karmic retribution also (death of closed one or sons and all that)

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Boomerang
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Re: Guan Yin Citta Dharma Door

Post by Boomerang » Sun Jun 14, 2015 10:36 pm

This link explains the process:

http://guanyincitta.com/en/introduction ... arma-door/

This was the first red flag for me:
2. Once you have made Great Vows, you must persistently keep to your vows. If you cannot fulfil your vows simply due to personal reasons, then it is very likely that you would receive karmic retributions.
One of the vows you take is:
Perform virtuous deeds, make donations to print <number of> Buddhist books, etc”; or distribute or donate <number of> books and CDs to people.
Okay, so when you join this group you have to vow to distribute their materials so that more people will join, or else you suffer karmic retribution? That sounds like a cult to me. They even have a little section on how to magically force your family members to join the group.

http://guanyincitta.com/en/7-applicatio ... y-members/

There is a risk of spirit possession.
15. If you are reciting Little Houses for someone else to cure his illness, it is possible that the foreign spirit that is currently occupying his body would come and occupy your body instead. [...] In the event that the other party’s Karmic Creditor comes to you, it is best to recite several Little Houses and address them to the “Karmic Creditor of <your full name>”. It is a grand virtue to save others, and saving people often involves taking responsibilities.
You are contracted to do this for the rest of your life, or else bad things will happen.
19. Please note that the transferring merits to foreign spirits by burning Little Houses is a life-long process, and it does not mean that after you have recited and burnt a certain number of Little Houses, you would never need to recite any more. [...] [If you were to stop, then] over time, a portion of your negative karmas would be activated and transformed into foreign spirits. You may also accidentally invite other foreign spirits to occupy your body due to one of the following reasons: having a fight with someone, and visiting the cemetery, hospital, or crematorium, etc.
"All the suffering of the lower realms, whatever difficulty and unhappiness we may experience as human beings, as well as every other possible suffering of the three realms of existence, have their origin in cherishing ourselves more than others."

Saoshun
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Re: Guan Yin Citta Dharma Door

Post by Saoshun » Mon Jun 15, 2015 8:15 am

First two quotes are normal to buddhism. I don't think they mean their school material rather buddhist sutras and teachings, its inspired by Liao Fan philosophy clearly.

the two last one looks like some taoist magic mixed with buddhist which is pretty regular in chinese buddhism but it's seems like unwise and unsecured system.

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Boomerang
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Re: Guan Yin Citta Dharma Door

Post by Boomerang » Mon Jun 15, 2015 1:33 pm

Saoshun wrote:First two quotes are normal to buddhism. I don't think they mean their school material rather buddhist sutras and teachings, its inspired by Liao Fan philosophy clearly.

the two last one looks like some taoist magic mixed with buddhist which is pretty regular in chinese buddhism but it's seems like unwise and unsecured system.
I learned something new today. Thank you for that.
"All the suffering of the lower realms, whatever difficulty and unhappiness we may experience as human beings, as well as every other possible suffering of the three realms of existence, have their origin in cherishing ourselves more than others."

Saoshun
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Re: Guan Yin Citta Dharma Door

Post by Saoshun » Mon Jun 15, 2015 1:40 pm

The better and safer option to the spirit magic it's to send them thru Usnisa Dharani, it's always works but I guess only small amount of people have enough merit to even try it ..

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Re: Guan Yin Citta Dharma Door

Post by Ayu » Mon Jun 15, 2015 1:49 pm

Saoshun wrote:The better and safer option to the spirit magic it's to send them thru Usnisa Dharani, it's always works but I guess only small amount of people have enough merit to even try it ..
:shrug: Then it can be neither better nor safer.
I have decided to stick with love.
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Saoshun
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Re: Guan Yin Citta Dharma Door

Post by Saoshun » Mon Jun 15, 2015 2:44 pm

It can because you are just acting as trigger for bodhisattwa to get action you do not mess thru different occult qualities of things but working thru agent which is also defensive and active, that's why reciting this dharani your spirit (shen) is spiked up (when someones recite it properly you feel like being in bubble of energy of bodhisattwa)

cjdevries
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Re: Guan Yin Citta Dharma Door

Post by cjdevries » Thu Jun 18, 2015 12:03 am

I have a lot of respect for the practice and how it has helped so many people. It has helped me through a difficult illness. There were many times that I would quit reciting for a while and get worse; then I would continue again and improve. So it was clear that it was helping me to build energy/heal. I would say I believe in the concept of karmic creditors. The idea is that many illnesses are caused by foreign spirits and that by helping them on we can recover our energy. That being said, I know the practice can be dangerous. The part that is most beneficial to me is sending energy to loved ones who have passed on. It seems clear to me that they do receive the energy from the mantras recited (based on my own experiences). But I've seen quite a few red flags. At this point, it would be hard for me to recommend the practice to anyone.

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