Sutras on Sexual Misconduct

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Re: Sutras on Sexual Misconduct

Post by Astus »

pael wrote: Fri Feb 01, 2019 10:08 amWhat if one's wife is a virgin?
It refers to girls under the protection of parents. When she becomes a wife, from then on she's under the protection of the husband.
When women is considered as a wife?
Traditionally when the parents give the woman to the groom.

The same line is translated in a more succinct manner by Shih Heng-ching (BDK ed, p 173) as: "If at an improper time or place one has sexual contact with women other [than one’s wife], one commits the offense of sexual misconduct."
1 Myriad dharmas are only mind.
Mind is unobtainable.
What is there to seek?

2 If the Buddha-Nature is seen,
there will be no seeing of a nature in any thing.

3 Neither cultivation nor seated meditation —
this is the pure Chan of Tathagata.

4 With sudden enlightenment to Tathagata Chan,
the six paramitas and myriad means
are complete within that essence.

1 Huangbo, T2012Ap381c1 2 Nirvana Sutra, T374p521b3; tr. Yamamoto 3 Mazu, X1321p3b23; tr. J. Jia 4 Yongjia, T2014p395c14; tr. from "The Sword of Wisdom"
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Re: Sutras on Sexual Misconduct

Post by TrimePema »

Miroku wrote: Sat Jan 26, 2019 3:02 am Hello,

I know I might be poking into a wasp nest with this question, however I would like to know what sutras are talking about sexual misconduct in general and maybe mentioning homosexuality/homosexual behaviour in particular. Also maybe discuss it a bit too.

So far I have mostly read Patrul Rinpoche who seems to be quite strict on the orifices, places and times of the day, however I am quite interested where this idea came from and what the Buddha had to say about it. I have heard that Gampopa and Je Tsongkhapa were of the same style. Are there some Tibetan sources that do not go with this line of thinking?
The reason they are so specific about orifices and times of day is because the monks were boning each other between sessions. Any type of sexual behavior that is not karmamudra is misconduct. Karmamudra only involves one orifice. If you are a monk, then karmamudra is off limits - period.
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Re: Sutras on Sexual Misconduct

Post by PeterC »

Miroku wrote: Sat Jan 26, 2019 3:03 pm According to these parts it actually seems that even sutra writings discourage from a same sex behaviour. Shame. :D
Not quite - the definitions of 非道 are commentaries, not the sutras themselves.

The actual sutras themselves stay pretty close to orthodox social norms for men in that time and in that culture, and they have a lot more to do with ownership rights than anything else. Note for instance the absence of commentary on female/female activities - which illustrates what the writers were concerned about.

The more general advice in all lineages of the dharma about grasping/aversion/etc. is not often cited with regard to sexual activities, but if it were, it would be a much stronger constraint than the very limited sutra comments on forbidden sexual activities.
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